Mick Mars really creeped me out as a kid, and looking back on it I think he was really an underappreciated aspect to their aesthetic. I wonder how many times it had been casually put in their ear to replace him with a hotter guy or a flashier player. He wasn't merely "The Unattractive One", like every band has, he truly had a vibe of dark menace that differentiated Crue for a lot of other bands in the genre. Warrant did not have anyone who looked like Mick Mars. It's one thing to put a pentagram decal on some bass drums, its another when it looks like one of the bandmembers might be a practicing warlock. He was really adding some bitter and umami to round out the flavor profile of the band.
Mick Mars was crucial - in the episode we talk about them seriously considering replacing him during a tour with Ozzy but Ozzy’s bassist convinced them not
I just finished the Crue pod, and also the really fun hair metal episode with Molly. Thanks for taking me back to my teens (and tweens, although the word didn't exist back then).
I was born in '72 and grew up in Canada, about 2000 km (that's 1200 miles) north of the Sunset Strip. It made me reflect quite a bit on how many of us ended up hair metal fans (if only briefly) in the 1980s, without necessarily embracing "real" metal. In my case, it was the transition between the less edgy New Wave acts that appealed to of 8-12 year old and the punk and college rock bands I loved by the time I was 16 (Replacements, Husker Du, REM). Your hair metal HoF discussion was great and I think your discussion with Molly highlights just how fun and subjective this discussion can be. For the record, in grade 7 suburban Canadian teenaged me was soundtracking Crue, Ratt, Def Lep, Twisted Sister, Cinderella, Van Halen, Faster Pussycat, Quiet Riot and Scorpions (yeah, I know they are German, but is there a better hair metal anthem than Rock You Like a Hurricane?) Off my list at that time were Iron Maiden, Judas Priest, and Ozzy (less accessible). And then there's the "baroque" age of hair metal, as you named it (by then, I had moved on). I'd throw Skid Row, Warrant, Winger, Poison, Slaughter, Mr. Big, Extreme, Damn Yankees, and Great White in here).
Additional fun facts:
1. I can attest that Tommy Lee spent a good deal of time staying in a house on Peto Place in Victoria, BC in 1984/85 -- just after Razzle died, and before Theatre of Pain was released. My 12-year-old friends and I would go there and knock on the door to see if we could get an autograph. This one kid Shane got Tommy to sign his cigarette pack.
2. At that time (or shortly after) Tommy' future wife Pamela was working the salad bar at The Keg restaurant on Quadra St., with my friend's sister Marisa. How is that for a sliding doors moment?
Anyway, thanks again. I keep thinking I couldn't love the pod any more, and then I do.
Motley Crue is a shit band but Too Fast For Love is a legitimately good record. Oh, the promise! Love the New York Dolls ref. Agreed. Keep plowing the fields. e.
I'm 53 years old, so yeah Crue were a formative part of my formative music discovery years. I thought it was interesting when you and your co-host asked about what the appeal of them was to young men back in the Shout era. One thing I thing you didn't mention is the "scaring the shit out of my parents" quotient.
If you were a good church-going Southern boy like myself, there was something about that early heavy metal that was intoxicating. I remember going into mall record stores, going to the metal section, and just staring at the album covers as a covert little thrill.
I recall seeing the Looks That Kill video on Friday Night Videos (as with many kids, I didn't have cable yet so this was the only way to watch if you didn't have a rich friend) and my 11-year-old self was RIVETED by what I saw, and part of the excitement was knowing that if I was caught watching THAT by my parents I was in a world of trouble, ha ha.
I can always spot the generation gap with my cousin who is 5 years older and a massive Crue fan, compared to me who came of age with grunge and hated hair metal as a consequence. He likes grunge too, but it doesn’t go the other way 😝 I can’t bring myself to listen to Motley Crue.
I didn't expect to enjoy this episode so much, but it's a damn good time as always. Listening to your opening, I was thinking how I couldn't remember what Nikki Sixx looked like, so did a little of the google and holy hell. HOW did this man escape my Gr. 7, 1989 crushing when Poison and GnR were in rotation, with a face as Sassy-cover worthy as Evan Dando (though perhaps a bit less feminist-aligned...). In other news, I gazed too long at Tommy's hairy legs swathed in saggy ripped fishnets and dirty sneakers in pic above and THAT ladyboner has died. RIP.
First of all, the part in the book about the girl and the phone (!!!), and second, I completely forgot about Tommy Goes to College so thanks for the reminder (I think).
There’s something almost touching about the attempt to extract nuance from the Crüe’s chaos, to find meaning in a band whose primary contribution to culture is making every strip club DJ’s life easier. They did mint the aesthetic of the ‘80s—latex nihilism, hairspray machismo, the unironic embrace of bad taste. But it’s worth remembering that what they really invented was the blueprint for cultural regression: the endless recycling of sleaze until it becomes nostalgia, then branding, then podcast fodder.
I can’t explain it but there is nothing sleazier sounding in music than Tommy Lee’s cowbell in Live Wire
100000000%
Mick Mars really creeped me out as a kid, and looking back on it I think he was really an underappreciated aspect to their aesthetic. I wonder how many times it had been casually put in their ear to replace him with a hotter guy or a flashier player. He wasn't merely "The Unattractive One", like every band has, he truly had a vibe of dark menace that differentiated Crue for a lot of other bands in the genre. Warrant did not have anyone who looked like Mick Mars. It's one thing to put a pentagram decal on some bass drums, its another when it looks like one of the bandmembers might be a practicing warlock. He was really adding some bitter and umami to round out the flavor profile of the band.
Mick Mars was crucial - in the episode we talk about them seriously considering replacing him during a tour with Ozzy but Ozzy’s bassist convinced them not
The New York Dolls comparison is spot on. Now I find myself wondering what Morrissey thought of Mötley Crüe…
Omg amazing question
Hey Yasi,
I just finished the Crue pod, and also the really fun hair metal episode with Molly. Thanks for taking me back to my teens (and tweens, although the word didn't exist back then).
I was born in '72 and grew up in Canada, about 2000 km (that's 1200 miles) north of the Sunset Strip. It made me reflect quite a bit on how many of us ended up hair metal fans (if only briefly) in the 1980s, without necessarily embracing "real" metal. In my case, it was the transition between the less edgy New Wave acts that appealed to of 8-12 year old and the punk and college rock bands I loved by the time I was 16 (Replacements, Husker Du, REM). Your hair metal HoF discussion was great and I think your discussion with Molly highlights just how fun and subjective this discussion can be. For the record, in grade 7 suburban Canadian teenaged me was soundtracking Crue, Ratt, Def Lep, Twisted Sister, Cinderella, Van Halen, Faster Pussycat, Quiet Riot and Scorpions (yeah, I know they are German, but is there a better hair metal anthem than Rock You Like a Hurricane?) Off my list at that time were Iron Maiden, Judas Priest, and Ozzy (less accessible). And then there's the "baroque" age of hair metal, as you named it (by then, I had moved on). I'd throw Skid Row, Warrant, Winger, Poison, Slaughter, Mr. Big, Extreme, Damn Yankees, and Great White in here).
Additional fun facts:
1. I can attest that Tommy Lee spent a good deal of time staying in a house on Peto Place in Victoria, BC in 1984/85 -- just after Razzle died, and before Theatre of Pain was released. My 12-year-old friends and I would go there and knock on the door to see if we could get an autograph. This one kid Shane got Tommy to sign his cigarette pack.
2. At that time (or shortly after) Tommy' future wife Pamela was working the salad bar at The Keg restaurant on Quadra St., with my friend's sister Marisa. How is that for a sliding doors moment?
Anyway, thanks again. I keep thinking I couldn't love the pod any more, and then I do.
Motley Crue is a shit band but Too Fast For Love is a legitimately good record. Oh, the promise! Love the New York Dolls ref. Agreed. Keep plowing the fields. e.
I'm 53 years old, so yeah Crue were a formative part of my formative music discovery years. I thought it was interesting when you and your co-host asked about what the appeal of them was to young men back in the Shout era. One thing I thing you didn't mention is the "scaring the shit out of my parents" quotient.
If you were a good church-going Southern boy like myself, there was something about that early heavy metal that was intoxicating. I remember going into mall record stores, going to the metal section, and just staring at the album covers as a covert little thrill.
I recall seeing the Looks That Kill video on Friday Night Videos (as with many kids, I didn't have cable yet so this was the only way to watch if you didn't have a rich friend) and my 11-year-old self was RIVETED by what I saw, and part of the excitement was knowing that if I was caught watching THAT by my parents I was in a world of trouble, ha ha.
Great fun revisiting this all in your pod.
It’s so true I didn’t think much about that part but it makes so much sense
I can always spot the generation gap with my cousin who is 5 years older and a massive Crue fan, compared to me who came of age with grunge and hated hair metal as a consequence. He likes grunge too, but it doesn’t go the other way 😝 I can’t bring myself to listen to Motley Crue.
But will still faithfully listen!
So every babysitter I had as a kid in South Florida dressed like this, and it is Why I Am Like This for sure
I didn't expect to enjoy this episode so much, but it's a damn good time as always. Listening to your opening, I was thinking how I couldn't remember what Nikki Sixx looked like, so did a little of the google and holy hell. HOW did this man escape my Gr. 7, 1989 crushing when Poison and GnR were in rotation, with a face as Sassy-cover worthy as Evan Dando (though perhaps a bit less feminist-aligned...). In other news, I gazed too long at Tommy's hairy legs swathed in saggy ripped fishnets and dirty sneakers in pic above and THAT ladyboner has died. RIP.
Someone brought the first Crüe record to school and it scared me.
hell yeah
I wanted to be good, until I didn’t.
First of all, the part in the book about the girl and the phone (!!!), and second, I completely forgot about Tommy Goes to College so thanks for the reminder (I think).
There’s something almost touching about the attempt to extract nuance from the Crüe’s chaos, to find meaning in a band whose primary contribution to culture is making every strip club DJ’s life easier. They did mint the aesthetic of the ‘80s—latex nihilism, hairspray machismo, the unironic embrace of bad taste. But it’s worth remembering that what they really invented was the blueprint for cultural regression: the endless recycling of sleaze until it becomes nostalgia, then branding, then podcast fodder.
crisis of confidence in the motley crue bandsplain